[mshunter]

1500tt, 300hrs 121 experince, ATP, and $16.00 an hour. this makes me sick to my stomach. for all of you that take this job, thanks for makeing the industry what it has become today! thousands spent on ratings, 4 years of college, and all the instructing that it took to get this far, for a pay cut!

I say shame on great lakes for offering us a position like this! we are skilled professionals, and this amount of compensation will not let us even live while we pay back all of our student loans!

[G8keeper]

1500tt, 300hrs 121 experince, ATP, and $16.00 an hour. this makes me sick to my stomach. for all of you that take this job, thanks for makeing the industry what it has become today! thousands spent on ratings, 4 years of college, and all the instructing that it took to get this far, for a pay cut!

I say shame on great lakes for offering us a position like this! we are skilled professionals, and this amount of compensation will not let us even live while we pay back all of our student loans!

Shame on great lakes for offering me a job? 1500TT and $16/hr? Last I heard, GLA offered $16/hr to first year FOs, not to the 1500hr guys with ATPs (Captains). Let me tell you why i respectfully disagree with your post in two words: Upgrade time.

GLA's low pay sucks. There's no question there. However- that keeps their attrition rates up which frees up left seats for FOs to move up quickly. GLA = Get in, get PIC time, go to majors ASAP. I think that its low pay is actually improving my quality of life because i could get paid $10 bucks more at AE or SKYW and sit right seat till I go gray, or get paid a little less and get my PIC time rapidly so I can get into a major.

Like you said- we're all professionals. Let's try to lift eachother up a little more. Don't ever shame a pilot for feeding his family. His financial situation is probably worse than yours and he may be a little more desperate.

Fly Safely.

This post has been edited by G8keeper: 23 December 2008 - 02:09 AM

[wildflyin]

I'd have to agree with G8keeper on this one. Lakes is acting like a true regional. They connect places that the majors can't fly into with hubs where people can make that connecting flight on a 737 or something. The pay, though low, reflects the number of seats they transport and legs they fly. It doesn't sound like a career place, but it does sound like a place where you can get your turbine PIC time and move on. I've heard from a lot of people (that I know personally, not just over a forum) that Lakes flying is well respected because of the skills you come away from there with. Once I have around 1500 hours I plan to apply there as well. I know the mins are lower, but I want to 1)Instruct for a while longer 2) get out of that 16 dollar an hour phase as fast as I can.

~Wild

[mshunter]

opnions duley noted. and ok, mabey i shouldent shame those who take this position for nothing other than the turb time. however, i dont see how it's possible to fed your family on $16 an hour, even if you work 120 hours a month. i do agree with putting food in the families mouth, i have a 2 year old son, and a wife. they are the reason i changed careers.

i still say shame on GL's for such low pay. even if they were to raise pay to $21-$22 an hour for FO's, to make up the difference in per-set price at 30 seats, charge $2 more a seat, and the cost is offset.

[Steve428]

opnions duley noted. and ok, mabey i shouldent shame those who take this position for nothing other than the turb time. however, i dont see how it's possible to fed your family on $16 an hour, even if you work 120 hours a month. i do agree with putting food in the families mouth, i have a 2 year old son, and a wife. they are the reason i changed careers.

i still say shame on GL's for such low pay. even if they were to raise pay to $21-$22 an hour for FO's, to make up the difference in per-set price at 30 seats, charge $2 more a seat, and the cost is offset.

I do understand your arguments, but respectfully disagree with some of your points. GLA's affect on the rest of the industry is not all that significant. They are a small EAS carrier who flies routes no other regional flies, and no other regional would want to fly. Lakes won't be used to whipsaw any other regional carrier, and doesn't fly any route that resembles a major airline route. If one has 1500 TT, there is no reason that person couldn't upgrade after 3 months at Lakes, which means that if you can swing $16/ hour for 3 months, life gets better. When you look at Lakes' pay, you have to understand that the majority of their operations happen in a 19 seat Beech 1900D, which is set up and legal for single-pilot operation; just not legal for single-pilot ops under Part 121. Pay should be higher, but can't fairly be compared to pay on any CRJ or ERJ. Pay on some of the larger CRJs, or ERJs should more appropriately be compared to major airline pay on a DC9, B717, etc., as the larger CRJs and ERJs were specifically designed to fly DC9, B717, B737, A319, etc. routes with pilots receiving significant less pay (regional pilots). If Lakes is bringing down pay in the regional industry, then I would argue that any carrier that operates anything over 30 seats is bringing down pay in the major airline industry. Personally, I always wanted a career position at a major, not a regional... If scope is relaxed any more than it has been, I seriously doubt there will be anything left for career positions, except for those with thousands and thousands and thousands... of hours, unless one is content spending an entire career flying a CRJ or ERJ. There's nothing wrong with that, but it's not what I want to do.

[Steve428]

Here's your comparison. Even this isn't fair and accurate, but it's more fair than comparing 1900 pay to CRJ200 pay.

$111.05 - $67.86 = $43.19, or a difference of $36,280 per year at a 70 hour guarantee.

The above is:
(Average of first 10 years of captain pay on Northwest DC9 and Midwest B717) MINUS (Average of first 10 years of captain pay on a regional CRJ900 operator, a regional ERJ175 operator, and a regional EMB 170 operator).

Who's really getting the shaft? Answer: we all are!

[Pilot Carlos]

It's unfair, but it is what it is. If you don't get that job, there are 100's of people behind you in line.

I'm 30 and have a girlfriend and kid to support. I switched careers in 2007 to flight instruction. Back then I was sure I'd be sitting in the right seat of a Horizon turboprop right about now. Because of the layoffs, the airlines are setting hiring standards I can't reach anymore and with pay lower to that as a flight insructor.

I keep on submitting the apps though, becuase even at $16 an hour, if I get hired I can still try and make it work somehow.